Process images: Viability of building a concert harp [Pictures] - created 01-29-2008

McCoole, Daniel - 01/29/2008.06:40:02

Hi everyone!

Firstly, I would like to say a big thanks to the MIMF for all the help and wisdom I have found within its many, many pages.

On to the story... My girlfriend is soon to become my fiance, and eventually my wife. I guess that I have the better part of two years until our wedding, and wondered whether I would be able to build a matched pair of 47 or 48 string concert harps in that time. I am not completely inexperienced in musical instrument construction with an electric guitar under my belt and an acoustic almost finished, but I am no full time luthier either.

I lack a conventional lathe to make the column, but have access to every other tool that I could conceivably need. A lathe could be a possibility in the very near future. I have a moderate understanding of the pedal mechanisms. I also realize that this is a hugely ambitious project and that I won't save money - this was not the goal.

In short, I am asking those with experience whether this is a feasible project.

If I get a positive majority, I will begin drawing the harps out full size and drafting pedal mechanisms. If the majority rules against it, I will start saving and maybe have the harps by our 25th anniversary!

Thanks for the help.

Dan

Do you both play?

I've been looking for diagrams for a pedal mech. for years (internet only) and have had zero luck. If designing from scratch, the mech will probably take several trys to get right. Two years is probably not enough time to make two or three go arounds of mechs to get to the one that works.

I would recommend looking for a design that's known to work first as it will save you a ton of time. If you find a resource, please post back here!

Wow, that's an ambitious project. Have you ruled out lever harps? Two lever harps would be doable in you time frame and plans are readily available. And you probably wouldn't need a lathe.

Check out Beat Wolff in Switzerland and Tim Hampson in UK, both make replicas of 18th-19th century pedal harps. Both are priced higher than working originals though...

Thanks for the quick responses!

Deb, neither of us plays yet, but we are both very interested in learning.

Andy, After four hours of searching online, I found a diagram of the sharping mechanism,the only part which I will have to design is the linkages to turn them. I invisioned cable and pulley linkages with the far end (inside the neck) attached to a spring to return the pedal to its upright position. I was intending to make mock-ups of the mechanism, just on a board or something, and not the full mechanism untill the harps need them.

The diagrams I found were in an online preview ofthe oxford guide to musical instruments, iirc.

Jon, yeah, I'm an ambitious sorta guy. I wanted pedal harps because of the ability to change while playing with both hands. I wouldn't need a lathe, could probably get away withoutone for life, but then what would I spend all my hard earned money on

Simon, will check them out as soon as i get home, thanks!

So would single action make this infinitely less complicated?

Once again, thanks everybody!

Dan

Daniel, if neither of you play the harp yet, I'd re-think this. The harp is not an easy instrument to play by a long shot. You might also consider a folk-harp instead, it's a lot more simple to build and to play (although certainly not easy), and the repertoire is much more accessible.

Deb, sound advice. Do you have any suggestions regarding how many strings, how big or small etc? I'm not too worried about it being a challenge to learn, as long as we wont just grow out of it.

From what I understand, there is a point where a folk harp limits what is available to play. Granted we may well never reach that point, I guess a folk harp would be an ideal trade off.

So yeah, suggestions or comments?

Thanks, Dan

The folk harp evolved to play folk tunes. It's not really a limited instrument. It is diatonic, but the addition of levers means you can play it in any key, and you simply adjust your technique to use a lever while playing if you need an accidental. You can also re-tune for specific tunes if you need to.

My inclination would be to suggest you make a small lap harp to build your skill set and get some playing experience. But even before that I'd get some recordings and see if you enjoy the repertoire, and if you'd prefer to play/build a nylon-strung or wire-strung harp. My own heart is given to the wire-strung harp, that's what I tried to learn on, and failed big. It was just too difficult for me.

Andy, After four hours of searching online, I found a diagram of the sharping mechanism,the only part which I will have to design is the linkages to turn them. I invisioned cable and pulley linkages with the far end (inside the neck) attached to a spring to return the pedal

The devil's in the details. What works for one mech very well might not when you've got four of them hooked together. If you're making prototypes, I'd suggest making at least two hooked together for proof of concept. Getting a complicated mechanism like this to work properly is much harder than you think.

I actually forgot that I did find some prints of mechs on the USPTO site that might give you a better idea of what you're up against. You'll definitely need access to a (metal) lathe and mill to make the parts as well as some method of cutting large sheet metal to exact shapes (e.g. laser or plasma cutting - this can be contracted out).

There's an outfit called Musikits (URL obvious) that has about 10 different harp kits including some with raising levers. Brows around there for ideas (or a kit!). It will cut a lot of time off.

MusicKits also sells plans, instructions, and hardware packs if you don't want to go the complete kit route.

For an inexpensive and easy-to-build alternative, Google up John Kovacs for Paraguayan harps. I built two of these and despite their simplicity, they still sound like harps - which is to say, pretty dang good.

I am not sure about modern designs but the older pedal harps use rods not cables.

This is like wanting to start playing keyboard, so starting by building a matched pair of full size grand pianos.

Deb - not quite right, the modern folk harp is really a 19th century invention, like those German guitar-lutes, only superficially basing themselves on older types. Folk harps were built by 19th century pedal harp makers, as a cheaper student alternative.

Hence the suggestions that you start with building, and learning to play on, a folk harp i.e. lever harp are just great.

If you want to aim towards classical music then you can get or build lever harps that have basically a shrunken pedal harp setup, same string tension, spacing, and bigger range. Some even have the classical aesthetics of the pedal harp but for a fraction of the cost. You will need to practice hard for years before you want to do things that levers can't but pedals can. And even then a good size lever harp is often essential for peractice and travel when the big one is inconvenient.

If you want to gravitate towards traditional or folk music then you can get or build lever harps that are smaller with lighter gauge strings, closer together, and more responsive soundboxes. These aren't grown out of; full time pros use the same basic design as schoolchildren.

If you want to gravitate towards historical music then this is where youre best off missing out both pedal harps and lever harps and going for historical reproductions. This is where the wire strings come in - some historical harps had brass or precious metal strings. Others had gut, but these latter usually had buzzing attachments like a sitar. Historical harps is a secret and difficult but enormous and captivating world that has little to do with pedal harps or lever / folk harps. Deb I never knew you tried wire-strung harps, or if I did I forgot.

I have an old Erard double action harp. I think building a harpsicord would be an easier task than reproducing one of these mechanisms. A lever harp is much more doable.

Yes, I had a lovely double-strung wire-strung folk harp built by Jay Witcher here in Maine, it utterly defeated me. Too many different things I had to do with every finger.

What is a "double-strung" harp? Is it paired courses, or a set of strings on each side, or something entirely different?

A set of strings on each side of the curve, tuned the same on both sides. I like a lot of tunes with accidentals and thought this way I could tune a string to the accidental on just one side if I needed it. This worked in theory, it would have worked a whole lot better if I had actually mastered the thing. Besides, the more metal strings, the better.

Daniel, when you made the guitars did you make the tuning machines on your guitars?

I have regulated and restored many harps, no easy job . A successful peddle harp from scratch requires more than two years of full time work. As stated you will need to be an experienced machinist.

The aforementioned kit is a great idea and can be spruced up by adding levers and replacing the plywood with solid wood, that is except the sound board, unless you reinforce it.

Simon, you said "Historical harps is a secret and difficult but enormous and captivating world that has little to do with pedal harps or lever / folk harps." Why do you say this, have you been having problems locating information? I restored a diatonic 17th century spanish column harp , definitely related to the pedal harp , it's direct predecessor. For celtic harps the Robert Armstrong book of 1904 is quite informative. Sacconi has Stadavaris gothic harp template in his book and I believe The Nuremberg Museum has available measurements on others. And oh , the iconography.

There is another type of mechanical harp that I have worked on , not pedal but similar mechanism. Check out harpist Eric Berglund's web page.

I guess what I aimed for with this project was the pedal harp aesthetic, more than the pedal harp itself. What can I say, I really find it beautiful! I was intending to take a more classical approach to playing, and was going to leave all the details as standard as possible. I think I will go with a levered column harp, I get the distinct impression this is far more manageable and a lot better suited to my time-frame.

I do have a question which has been eating away at me for a while - How is the sound box constructed typically? I can foresee an incredibly large amount of time either painstakingly fitting lots of tiny ribs, or possibly even longer carving it out of a solid log in the same manner as the old wire-strung Irish harps.

Thanks for all the help everyone, it is greatly appreciated. Also, thanks for pointing me in a more realistic direction with this project! I'll begin drafting the plans as soon as possible.

Deb, if possible, would you like me to send my plans in so the rest of the forum has access?

Yes, that would be great if it's in DXF or DWG format.

Stephen, quite the contrary, I have spent many years collating evidence and now act as a kind of historical harp clearing house especially for the Irish and Scottish material. Yes I agree it is connected via the Spanish baroque instruments but that is like how violin and guitar are connected via viols. Too many people try and go straight from modern American folk harp to 13th century European bray harp like they were basically the same thing.

No wonder you were defeated Deb, double stringing is hard enough on any harp but on a quality early Irish harp like Jay's, hardly anyone in the world is up to playing such a beast. It's like I suppose taking beginner lessons on a massive Wurlitzer cinema organ. There are good reasons why the early Irish harp tradition remained strictly diatonic right through to its demise.

Back to the subject in hand, yes levered column harp sounds like this is what you should aim for. You may well be able to find plans to purchase online. There are certainly a number of commercial makers producing such instruments, e.g. David Kortier. There are two ways to make the soundbox of a pedal harp or lever harp, the older classical one is to bend the back, I think you use veneers and do your own laminate to make a semicircular (or approx) shell, line the edges with stringers and glue on top and bottom blocks and crossgrain spruce soundboard. There are usually a couple of oblong access holes in the centre of the back. The other way is basically the same but the back like a lute with a number of tapered ribs. Some modern folk harps go even simpler and use just 3 ribs plus soundboard i.e. having a square section box but that would demolish your classical aesthetic. If you get good plans it should not be hard to glue up the box. At the base of the soundbox you have a separate assembly glued on, this is the 'pedal box' or base, a couple of inches high, it has a foot at each corner, the soundbox and pillar both rise from it. The neck would be best made from 3 laminations glued side by side, doweled or tenoned into the back of the pillar capital, and screwed down onto the top block of the soundbox. You can purchase the hardward - a taper tuning pin, bridge pin, and lever, for each string, plus a reamer to match the pins, from a harpmakers supplier. Strings will be probably the most expensive part of this project, even the cheapest nylon strings are pricy. You can get away without using a lathe if you purchase a big parallel sided cylindrical rod for the column, and fabricate square, hexagonal or octagonal capitals for it.

Oh and do get some kind of reputable plans - the layout of the strings in regard to relative lengths is quite sensitive, and too many homemade harps fail because the string lengths are unproportional and it ends up sounding just dull.

Carving from a log is for the completely different unrelated type of instrument, the historical Gaelic harp, here the soundboard is carved in one piece from a very soft wood, typically willow, with the ends and sides, and the back is a separate panel press-fitted in. Some medieval harps were made like a clamshell from two symmetrical pieces. But I never heard of any harp with a carved box and separate applied soundbox.

Daniel,

Simon,

Violin ,viol, guitar? Surly you can do better. How about forte piano then metal framed piano. The early Spinach baroque column harp is exactly what the pedal harp evolved from. The rounded back and extended harmonic curve (vs narrow gothic ) and the turned ornamented column. The violin is related to the viola da bracio not viol (or gamba) , though the viol is called a bowed guitar the guitar evolved wholly independently. poor analogy in my opinion.

Stephen - drifting off topic, yes poor perhaps, though pedal harps come from German / Bohemian harps rather than direct from the Spanish type (which have a much deeper and wider box). Also the Spanish harp did not come out of the northern European gothic bray harp I dont think. But it is all very complex and confusing, that's the point I was trying to make.

Excellent suggestion for making 2 staved backs.

that's the point I was trying to make.

Please continue, I for one find this historical stuff fascinating.

Simon,

Midwestern influence , I love it , thats what I get for sounding pompous.

I meant Mid-Eastern influence.

Even more correctly it should be mid-eastern and Moorish (or northern African) influence. Those Iberians were quite creative.

image link

This is the "Wartburg", some suggest it is a 19th century fake, but either way it is typical of the Northern European medieval harps depicted in paintings etc. It has gut strings and buzzing 'bray pins' set at the soundboard.

I agree with everything you say except the Midwestern bit!

Here is the seventeenth century Spanish harp I restored. Three years and thousands of small repairs. Working on it opened a door of interest in me that lead to a great deal of research on the history of the harp. Make note of the extreme trianglization or coning of the sound-box. As Simon points out this was feature was to be refined in the pedal harp. This was a travel harp and comes apart with the loosening of the strings. Though of definite Spanish origins it had repairs that showed evidence of being done in the new world. I have confidence that it spent a time at sea.

A point of fascination for me is the surprising amount of volume Gothic harps, as the photo Simon presented, are capable of , even with out the bray pins. Most modern builders of folk harps often build as more sound box equals more volume , not so. A properly made gothic harp weighs very little and caries a strong voice.

For those wishing to explore more on the harp you must check out Simon's very authoritative sight on the celtic history. Also visit "harp spectrum" on line as they have many authoritative articles from many sources including some of my favorites; Cheryl Fulton on gothic harp , Beat Wolf , and Hannelore Devaere's work on the Spanish influence. I have seen Cheryl perform half steps on a non levered diatonic harp by use of her thumb nail as a stop.

My madness in insisting the Spanish influence is that too often in the past it has been swept under the rug in the history books. Out side of Ireland and the Highlands few cultures have given as much importance to the harp as Spain, especially in the sixteenth thru eighteenth centuries. The Spanish gave us the column harp. The tuning mechanisms started with the hook system, an early form of what we now refer to as levers. The origin of this seems to be debated between northern Italy and southern Germany (of course they weren't Italy and Germany back then), and some even infer France, in the latter part of the seventeenth century. Diderot gives us three plates and a good deal of text ( including an interesting history) of the earliest form of pedal harps, before metal plates were involved, in the middle of the 18th century.

So would Spain be considered the southwest of Europe? If so would that make Switzerland the midwest?

Getting back to building a FOLK harp AND learning to play: that's been my focus the past two years. What follows are personal opiniions, drawn from research, the practical experience of a newbie builing a couple/three, and professional instruction. Let's go to the last first.....

1) Many (if not all) concert hapists (harpers play the lever harp) begin their training on lever harps - the Lyon & Healey Trobadours (SP?) for example. A budding harpist has a tremendous amount of stuff to learn, quite beyond messing around with pedals, and of course a pedal harp is much more expensive than a lever harp.

2) Start with a 4+ octave lever harp. I built a lap harp from scratch first (26 strings), then a 33-string from a MuskMaker kit (excellent tone for the price BTW - my instructor loves it), bought a fully levered Dusty Strings FH26 and have several on the drawing board. Soooo, opionion here is a) do the research first b) consider a kit as a learning tool c) build a 4+ octave lever harp before thinking of tackling a pedal harp. That is more engineering than woodworking anyway!

3) Research! I highly recommend and am indebted to Rick Kemper (Sligo Harps) who put up a wonderful description of building the lever harp (google it). If cas permits, get Jeremy Brown's book (from Music Makers). Building from scratch - consider aircraft ply soundboard first, before a solid wood one. And finally, be aware that harp strings are custom made, you can't just walk into the loacl music shop and buy them. Another reason to start with a kit! And lever ain't cheap either. So until feeling conifdent with playing, you can always tuen up from C to D, etc. without levers.

4) Harp making and playing is addictive!!!!

Have fun.

Biagio